Clean Water Works
CLEVELAND, OHIO: From the Northeast Ohio Regional Sewer District, an in-depth and fun conversation led by Donna Friedman and Mike Uva on any and all topics related to clean water, wastewater treatment, stormwater management, and the people, projects, and programs serving Lake Erie and our local waterways and communities.
Clean Water Works
A 2024 Clean Water Recap with Kyle Dreyfuss-Wells
What do horse riding and leading a utility have in common? Sewer District CEO Kyle Dreyfuss-Wells shares her top projects of 2024, the Cleveland bonds that fuel her enthusiasm, and insights that will resonate with leaders from all walks of life.
The Northeast Ohio Regional Sewer District manages both wastewater and stormwater systems and plays a crucial role in restoring local waterways. We delve into the challenges of urban water infrastructure, the importance of partnerships, and the delicate balance needed to address environmental and community concerns. Looking to 2025, we consider the crucial role of leadership at the US EPA and Department of Energy, greenhouse gas and "forever chemicals," and the power of mindful communication in building community.
Acronyms used in this episode:
CERCLA - Comprehensive Environmental Response, Compensation, and Liability Act of 1980. The Act provides for liability, compensation, cleanup, and emergency response for hazardous substances released into the environment and the cleanup of inactive hazardous waste disposal sites.
PFAS - Per- and polyfluoroalkyl substances. Perfluorooctanoic acid (PFOA) is a synthetic chemical that's part of PFAS chemicals.
I was asking around, I was like, hey, you know we're interviewing Kyle, like anybody got any questions that they want to know. And one was podcasts, fave Podcasts, which we already know. It's this one, it's definitely one. And then the other person asked if you would be willing to share your top five rappers and I said, well, I mean I think we can ask about you know favorite music.
Speaker 3:Check Yourself is an anthem, right? It's just every Monday Check yourself before you wreck yourself.
Speaker 1:That's how you roll out, that's the way it's got to go.
Speaker 2:And this is Clean Water Works a podcast.
Speaker 1:About clean water here at the Northeast Ohio Regional Sewer District.
Speaker 2:We are very happy today to have a return guest, kyle Dreyfus-Wells the. Ceo of the Northeast Ohio Regional Sewer District.
Speaker 3:Thank you. I'm glad to be here on this beautiful sunny day. It is nice out.
Speaker 2:The sun's coming in the windows. It's really sunny.
Speaker 3:Gorgeous.
Speaker 2:Kyle, you were last here in April 2023.
Speaker 3:Wow, is that right?
Speaker 1:Amazing. Does it feel short or long?
Speaker 3:Well, isn't that an interesting question, right? Because it feels super short. But then you think back that it's been what a year, and more than a half More than a half yeah. But I am a podcast listener.
Speaker 2:Not just our podcast. No, no, no. All the podcasts.
Speaker 3:I listen faithfully to every episode of Clean Water Works. I love that, oh yeah.
Speaker 2:Do you have other podcasts to recommend to our audience?
Speaker 3:Well, if they're interested in any horse-related podcasts. I could give you a long list of those oh really. But I really feel like I am now probably just talking to maybe three interested individuals.
Speaker 2:Have you gotten even more into horses since we last spoke?
Speaker 1:I'm so far in. You were an avid rider, then I'm so far in there's no turning back now.
Speaker 3:Oh no, no, no, there's no turning back. Yeah, I'm in deep.
Speaker 2:Meaning learning about them or doing more horse-related activities.
Speaker 3:No, the amount of time that I devote to learning how to ride a horse is probably the same as when I was with you guys in April of 2023. But that's you know. It's pretty high, Like if I'm not at the district or if. I'm not running, or if I'm not traveling for work, or you know, with the fam I'm at the barn.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Is that a solitary pursuit or do you do that activity with the horse enthusiasts? Oh yeah.
Speaker 3:Yes, that's right, it is a two mammal activity. No, there's a community.
Speaker 3:It's a community of other people that are really, really into horses.
Speaker 3:So like any you know hobby-based community, right, I think for other folks it's like what are they actually talking about?
Speaker 3:But if you're in the community you know we're all in.
Speaker 3:Like it's just nonstop chatter about horses and how other people ride and how other competitions went, and it's a really complicated sport because you both have to control your body and then you're also interacting with another animal and so that animal has reactions and emotions and so you really have to sort of figure out how you're interacting with that animal.
Speaker 3:And it's so interesting because a horse you know they don't have vice, right Like they're not doing something because they're jealous or they're not doing something because they were mad at you about something that happened a couple of days ago. So it just really requires you to be honest with yourself and to be aware of this other animal which you know I just think is really interesting, like from an emotional intelligence standpoint, like kind of trying to figure out my horse his name's Carino like what is Carino reacting to and really to understand that. And then there's a lot of skill in terms of how you use your hands and how you use your legs and how you use the balance of your seat, and it's also one of those things that you only get better at by actually doing it.
Speaker 1:So, like between your last podcast with us and now, what was your riding accomplishment? What goal did you achieve?
Speaker 3:Well, getting to know this horse, because he's more horse than an amateur rider, which is what I am should have. So I had to get myself to the right trainer and I had to, you know, learn to work with her. So we really had a lot. You know, I always say storming, norming and performing. Karina and I are still in the storming and norming phase.
Speaker 1:We're getting closer to the performing. I don't think I've heard you use that phrase before that's okay. So the storming and norming.
Speaker 3:That's one of the theories of group dynamics that we learned in graduate school is that you get a group of people together and first there's a lot of storming right Like people are figuring out you know they're kind of positioning and trying to figure out who's going to do what. And there's norming like what are the norms of the group? And once you get through storming and norming you can actually get to performing. So Carino is out of a stallion named Casal, who is a somewhat famous jumping stallion from Europe.
Speaker 3:He has his own mind and so it takes the right trainer to sort of and rider to sort of contain that and funnel that into performance as opposed to funneling that into being distracted or caring about what other horses are doing or not wanting to go forward. You know, just think how amazing it is that we take this 1,500-pound animal that really could have their say in things right and they agree to move forward in the direction that you tell them to. I mean it's pretty remarkable. So to have that relationship you have to have the horse sort of be a willing participant in that, and if you have a headstrong horse that is allowed to not participate in that, at some point that can get to a point where you can't get them back into the game. That makes sense.
Speaker 2:Probably an apt metaphor for running a utility. Since you were last with us, what are some of the biggest accomplishments, or achievements or things that you're most excited about here at the sewer district and specifically for the residents of Northeast?
Speaker 3:Ohio, our work, which is often or. I see our folks presenting, you know, every time, devonna Marshall, our current director of engineering and construction, to be our next chief operating officer in 2025. Every time she presents, for example, on the work of our engineering and construction department, which you know, that's kind of a whole of district thing. Right, you've got a lot of folks but our engineering and construction department, the work that they're doing. We finish mining of the shoreline tunnel, we start construction of the southerly tunnel, we activate the westerly tunnel and the pump station. I mean it's just boom, boom, boom and that's.
Speaker 3:Each one of those is a huge, multi, multi, multi-million dollar project, multi-year project, complicated underground construction, and we just continue to do it and it's just. It's not amazing because that's the brand you know, that's what our people do, but it is amazing how complicated underground construction can be and the potential risks that are there. And as much as we try to make sure we know everything, you know there's unknowns that can happen. So I'm really, really proud of all the work under Project Clean Lake. And then also we reached the conclusion of our fifth amendment to the consent decree with US EPA Ohio EPA Department of Justice to really craft that amendment and move that forward.
Speaker 2:I want to back up a little on that. We have a consent decree, which is an agreement with the federal government and the Justice Department to clean up our waterways. Basically, Right. Combine sewer overflows. We had this original consent decree and this is an amendment to that agreement. Why do we do that? Why do we have an amendment to it?
Speaker 3:Yeah, so we signed the consent decree in 2011, you'll recall and then we call it Project Clean Lake. So, all the work that's related to our 25-year $3 billion consent decree with, as you said, mike, the US EPA Department of Justice, ohio, epa, ohio Attorney General's Office, and that's really to deal with the 4 billion gallons of remaining overflow into Lake Erie, cuyahoga River, et cetera.
Speaker 3:And so, as you go through that 25-year process, which involves us constructing seven deep tunnels in addition to the Mill Creek Tunnel which we built before we signed, the consent decree, so we'll have a total of eight deep tunnels and then all the other construction work that goes along with it increased capacity at each one of our plants, chemically enhanced high-rate treatment at our plants all of that work as you go through it, you learn, we learn as we go along, and then you want to be able to modify the consent decree so that you can implement the learning from the process as we've gone through that.
Speaker 3:So we've worked with the Department of Justice and US EPA to amend the consent decree several times, and in 2018, we took a comprehensive look at the consent decree and we said what's left, like what are the changes that we want to make as we sort of land this plane in 2035?
Speaker 3:And so we came to the government with a series of modifications that we wanted to make at the plants and across the system, and now, with this Fifth Amendment, we're putting into place the last of those, which relates to chemically enhanced high rate treatment at Easterly, and we made modifications at Southerly and we made some modifications at Westerly. So it's really this idea of continual improvement, like learning from the construction projects that we've already done, learning from the modeling that we do in advance of each one of these construction projects and then putting that into action. And that, I think, is really on brand with the sewer district, because we're always looking at ways to save our ratepayers dollars and then also looking at ways to make sure that we're building projects that are easier or more straightforward to operate, because operation and maintenance is a big source of ongoing expense.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we've been. I think you mentioned that Easterly high-rate treatment project that just kicked off design started design this year and it's been really interesting sitting in those meetings and hearing thoughts from you know, the maintenance folks and well, how would we get in that? Or you know like, okay, well, if you put this in this location, then we have to step over this weir wall, and so it is really fun to watch the teams really work together from the consultant side and then from not only our engineering and construction side, but also we pull the maintenance folks in early so that their input's really taken into account. I think that's really important for the you know the functionality of the whole system.
Speaker 3:Yeah, exactly, plus making sure that we're getting all those lessons learned that folks have gotten from actually living with equipment and trying to maintain it and doing it on that daily basis and then make sure that that's implemented, integrated into the design, or if something's not going to be integrated into the design, then having that conversation about why it's not, so that everybody comes to a common, at least alignment, about decisions. I think the other thing that's so great about that Easterly conversation is that we're also bringing in our arborist to have a conversation about how do we lay out this design to be the most cost effective and have the least impact on these legacy trees that are there. So that's a whole really cool conversation.
Speaker 2:Do we lose a lot of trees over there, some of the storms we did.
Speaker 3:We had that last storm that took a big, like you know. You saw it almost like it went through in a horizontal direction and just shaved off the tops, but again, because we have a focus on trees as an important part of climate resiliency, important part of heat island effect, stormwater management, et cetera, we have that conversation about what trees we're going to replant, how we're going to replant them, when we're going to replant them, and everybody's in that conversation also.
Speaker 1:So we started construction on the Southerly Tunnel. I remember that from this year, watching the giant bore machine.
Speaker 3:Yeah, come down East 49th Street, at least the cutterhead that was really cool.
Speaker 1:That was really cool, so that started construction at that shaft site across from our EMSC building and then design on the Big Creek Tunnel.
Speaker 3:The last tunnel.
Speaker 1:Working with some of our communities on that, which has been exciting.
Speaker 3:And completed mining on the Shoreline Tunnel.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so big things on the wastewater side of things with Project Clean Lake and the achievements that you've noted.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Let's talk a little bit about stormwater management. One of the big accomplishments this year was completion of the West Creek Stabilization, the largest stream stabilization project under our regional stormwater management program. I'm wondering if I imagine a lot of first-time listeners to this podcast might not be aware that the sewer district is responsible for streams and local waterways.
Speaker 3:Well, they should be aware, that's why we're here.
Speaker 1:That's why we're here.
Speaker 3:Listen up podcast listeners. The Northeast Ohio Regional Sewer District operates two separate utilities. We have a wastewater sanitary sewer utility which is funded through one funding stream that our customers pay, and then we have a separate regional stormwater management program, which is a stormwater utility funded through an impervious surface fee. So our customers pay two fees. We have two separate utilities and we work, you know, seamlessly, learning from one another as we implement those programs. But, as you say, Mike, our regional stormwater management program is focused on really knitting back together the watersheds across our 363 square miles of the Northeast Ohio Regional Sewer District. So, on the wastewater side, we work in partnership with our member communities. We take care of the big sewers, wastewater treatment plants. They take care of the smaller sewers that get the sanitary sewage to us. On the stormwater side, we take care of the big streams. They're responsible for the smaller streams. Really great partnerships. We do a lot to support their work on the smaller streams and on the smaller sanitary sewers.
Speaker 3:But yes, in 2024, we completed the West Creek stabilization, which it's the largest by dollar value. I think it came in at 17 or 18 million. You know, West Creek is this really cool stream that is a tributary to the Cuyahoga River and these streams. You've got West Creek, Big Creek, Mill Creek. These are all the large tributaries to the Cuyahoga River that have really been beat up as the communities developed in Cleveland and then out because we didn't know any better in terms of how to manage streams, and so this restoration is really, really cool.
Speaker 3:Partnership with Ohio Department of Transportation this is addressing erosion issues. Erosion issues, really significant erosion along the stream corridor, and when you're dealing in a highly urban environment, you have to do as much as you can right. There's places where you're going to have to harden the stream bank because it's so constrained. If you can expand out floodplain, you grab it where you can. If you can work in partnership with a property owner that's in the floodplain that wants to sell, we'll buy those folks out. We'll do some property floodplain expansion, which is what we're doing on Mill Creek in Warrensville Heights. Really really cool project there that will, I think, start construction in 25? Cricket.
Speaker 1:Yep. Yep Cricket Lane in Warrensville Heights will start in twenty twenty five.
Speaker 3:We've been working through some utility coordination there, but we have all the property we need and looking forward to starting that project for sure. And that's a partnership with the city of Warrensville Heights and the landowners, because we'll buy property if people are interested in selling it and we buy it at fair market value. And then also completing the pre-design into design on the Dome Brook restoration at Horseshoe Lake Park. So that's cool.
Speaker 2:Now.
Speaker 3:Okay, is this the intervention? This is when we get into the real talk.
Speaker 1:What were some of the biggest challenges?
Speaker 2:over the last year, or some of the hurdles.
Speaker 3:Challenges in 2024? Any leader or any effective manager or anybody you know trying to be successful in their workday. I call it your daily knitting Like you're just sort of going through issues that have to be solved. Knitting Like you're just sort of going through issues that have to be solved, making sure that you're solving them with the biggest, with the best facts that you have and with a sense of urgency and with a sense of fairness. So I mean, we had some pretty big litigation against the Dome Brook restoration at Horseshoe Lake Park. So that that clearly was. It was an actual challenge. Because an actual challenge because folks were taking us to court and were taking the cities of Shaker Heights and Cleveland Heights to court.
Speaker 2:Probably need a little background on this project Dome Brook Restoration and Horseshoe Lake Park. Yeah, just a little background on that.
Speaker 3:So Dome Brook is one of these great direct tributaries to Lake Erie on the east side. There's some on the west side as well. But these direct tributaries to Lake Erie on the east side, there's some on the west side as well. But these direct tributaries are small watersheds, small square miles and a lot of fall. So Dome Brook starts what in Beachwood?
Speaker 3:comes down through Shaker Heights, cleveland Heights, into the city of Cleveland and it's a watershed that the sewer district has a lot of familiarity with. We've done a lot of studies on it. We did the Dan Valley Tunnel, one of our east side tunnels under Project Clean Lake, worked with the Art Museum to do a great restoration on Doan Brook in Rockefeller Park. So we're very active. We're a big part of the Doan Brook Watershed Partnership, so been part of that.
Speaker 3:So the Shakers who lived in Shaker Heights built dams on Dome Brook and one of those dams created Horseshoe Lake and there is Horseshoe Lake Park and that dam is 170, 180 years old earthen dam with holes in it and it is well out of compliance and never was in compliance with any Ohio Department of Natural Resource rules, who are the controller of dams in the state of Ohio. So that dam either had to be taken out or had to be fixed and under the Regional Stormwater Management Program there's no rationale for us to fix that dam. It doesn't provide water source, it doesn't power anything, it doesn't provide flood control, and so at Horseshoe Lake Park we are in the process. The dam's already breached because there's a serious public safety issue, which is why there's a sense of urgency around that project. So we're in the process, working with those two cities and with the city of Cleveland, to actually fully remove the dam and restore the brook which is awesome From a water quality perspective, from a usability.
Speaker 3:You know that whole park between Lee Road and Park is 60 acres a great public process to figure out what that's going to look like, and so that's that project. And so the litigation was basically around folks who wanted to have a dam, wanted to maintain a dam, to maintain a lake and maintain kind of the status quo.
Speaker 2:So that litigation is completed? Yep, we're litigation is completed.
Speaker 3:Yep, we're full steam ahead.
Speaker 2:What are your thoughts on the November election and how it will impact the sewer district, other utilities regulations, things like that? General thoughts.
Speaker 3:Yes, I mean at the district, we roll with what's in front of us. So you know, we just keep moving forward. So anytime you have a change in administration, there's a question of who's going to be leading US EPA and then also who's going to be leading Department of Energy, because we're doing a lot of work on our greenhouse gas controls and making sure that we're maximizing our renewable energy facility, making sure that we're controlling our electricity use, which is obviously a huge component of our greenhouse gas emissions. So those two agencies in terms of US EPA, Department of Energy, who's going to be leading those? What kind of policy focuses are going to be important for them? Are going to be important for them?
Speaker 3:We obviously stay up to date with state policy and federal policy through our manager of legislative affairs and then also through our National Association of Clean Water Agencies. So right now, you know, we do have a new director of US EPA named. It doesn't appear to have like a huge amount of runtime with the agency, but we will, you know, meet with that person. So we just take it as it comes and and we'll adapt to the new administration the same way we adapted to when President Biden came into office, and make changes and go along.
Speaker 1:Is there any specific focus for you moving into 2025?
Speaker 3:Yeah, so it's really interesting. So, if you look at my goals for 2025 and the priorities for 2025 that I laid out, many of them are a continuation of the work that we did, because, you know, at the district, we're here forever, right, and so we want to make sure that we continue to build those good relationships locally. It's so important to make sure that we have these great relationships with the port, with the metro, parks, with all of our member communities. So, continuing to tend to those relationships and do that work and then make sure that we have good relationships nationally, that we're up to date on research, on new regulations, that we can sort of see things coming, because if you can see things coming, you can plan your response to those activities.
Speaker 3:I think one of the big things, though, for us in 2025 is this whole conversation around machine learning and making sure that we understand the implications of that for the district. So, working with IT and some of the other departments, we have a group of folks that are focused on what we're currently doing along the lines of machine learning, any policies that we might need to put into place, any new adaptations that we might need to make. So what is the benefit to people doing their work. How does it make it more efficient? And I know that there's a lot of benefits and that there's a lot of efficiencies that we can gain, and so you're just looking at all of that in a really deliberate approach. That's a focus for 2025, for sure.
Speaker 2:One thing we haven't talked about in a while on this podcast is this issue of these forever chemicals.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:These PFOS and PFOA and all the various acronyms to describe these chemicals that come off of, you know, teflon, pans, cosmetics.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:That end up in the wastewater and they're not great. No, they're not great. Just a little bit about that and any changes in how those chemicals are handled, how it impacts the utility, like ours in terms of new regulations.
Speaker 3:So I think, first, you know, the district approach is first to understand what the public health and environmental issues are, regardless of what the regulatory landscape is, because, you know, we want to do the right thing for the environment and for our customers. So we have a group of folks all making sure that we understand the universe right. So what's the science around PFAS and all these PFAS-related chemicals? What's the science? What does it say from a wastewater perspective versus a drinking water perspective? So, making sure that we understand the science, and then making sure that we understand the science, and then making sure that we understand the regulatory landscape this is one of the things where we'll need to watch, with the new EPA, how those regulations change, because we have some regulations under the Safe Drinking Water Act which obviously don't directly affect the sewer district, but we want to be cognizant of those, and then understanding any regulations that might come out through the MPDES permit mechanism.
Speaker 3:So there's this awareness, and we're not the only ones that are looking at this. Obviously, the NAWQA National Association of Clean Water Agencies is looking at this as well. A couple of the big things, though, is that you want to make sure that this is a polluter pay situation. So keep in mind that these PFAS chemicals were made and currently are made by folks that do waterproofing, firefighting foams, all that kind of stuff. So you want to make sure that we avoid, as a country, a situation where those private sector companies continue to make those chemicals, sell those chemicals to all of us and we all have to recognize our role in this. If you want eyeliner that doesn't come off in the rain, you got to ask why.
Speaker 2:How is that happening? What are the?
Speaker 3:consequences For your cat eye yeah exactly, and I do think that we all have to understand our role in this. Sure Right. There is really no free lunch. These chemicals have a consequence. They're so good at their job and that's why those fluorine bonds are so hard to break down. One of the things that we're doing at the NAWQA level is making sure that there's an understanding that you can't put the cost on public utilities to deal with these at the end of the pipe. That's not the most effective way to deal with it.
Speaker 2:So we're having Got to fix the problem further up the chain.
Speaker 3:Fix the problem further up the chain. So that's a big conversation. And then there's the current topic is liability related to the Superfund regulation, which is the CERCLA regulation. So we've been doing a lot of work at the federal level to make sure that wastewater utilities are not looped into Superfund responsibility as it relates to PFAS. So that's a conversation.
Speaker 3:Also. If these chemicals are so bad and we know that they're not good for human health and the environment, then why are we still producing them and why are they still in eye makeup and jackets and stain-resistant carpet? And we do definitely want to make sure that we're not producing something at the top of the chain and then the public paying for it again at the bottom of the chain to take it out through a wastewater treatment process because it'd be incredibly expensive. I think it would just dwarf combined sewer overflow in terms of an expense. So we have to be real and upfront about those conversations. There's folks that are much smarter on this than me and I guarantee you that there's a policy approach that could fix this if we were sort of collectively interested in implementing it.
Speaker 1:One of the things that I admire about your leadership andday that it's very hard to catch up when those things do hit you, yeah, so I agree.
Speaker 3:I would add to that, though just we need to continue to be grateful for and recognize how incredibly fortunate we are at the sewer district. How incredibly fortunate we are at the sewer district, I mean we were able to be forward thinking and we're able to sort of kind of see the train coming because we have a great staff, we have clarity around our mission, we have clarity around how we do our work, we're supported by a great board and a great community, and those things come because we do great works. It's a cycle. We operate with a sense of urgency. If someone calls us, we call them back. If we don't know an answer, we say we don't know. If we can fix something, we fix it. You know the idea that no only gets you so far.
Speaker 3:So, try to figure out a way to solve problems and when you take that approach, people trust you and that trust is the key to all of it. And you see organizations, cities where that trust is broken and then it's really hard to get anything done.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and we aren't working in a vacuum. I think, like you were saying earlier about relationships with our member communities, with our partner agencies, with other governmental staff, be it state or federal, I think that working on these future issues with all of them really helps keep that ball rolling and we kind of feed off of each other to keep it going.
Speaker 3:Absolutely.
Speaker 2:Are there big things going on in Cleveland that you've been excited about the last year and looking forward to 2025?
Speaker 3:I love Cleveland, Like I love the city. I love how wonderful it is to live here. So I'm super excited about Irish Town Bend. I am super excited about the stabilization of the hillside and the sewer.
Speaker 3:I know other people are super excited about the park, but you know everybody's allowed to have their own priorities, so I'm super excited about the park but, um, you know everybody's allowed to have their own priorities, so I'm super excited about that project. I think that all the development around the river the metro, parks, the lakefront it's just totally awesome how easy it is to get outside, how easy it is to ride your bike, um you know, I just love living in the cle and, but I am super excited about Irish Town Bend.
Speaker 1:And that's the project across from Merwin's Wharf, sort of on the east side of West 25th. Yeah, there is a very steep slope in that area and we have a sewer that runs under that slope Right and so the sewer district is partnering with many other agencies, including the Metro Parks, to stabilize that. Many other agencies, including the Metro Parks, to stabilize that. There's been a lot of discussion around our lakefront and then our Cuyahoga River waterfront. Just wondering if you had any thoughts on those projects or anything you're looking forward to or how the sewer district might be involved.
Speaker 3:Well, I think the sewer district is involved in the everyday right. Like the water quality is what it is, because of the work that the people of the sewer district do and the trust that all of our customers have put into us. I mean, it's not an accident that the water quality in the Cuyahoga River has improved and the water quality in Lake Erie has improved just because of our work, and so I'm just really proud of that. So, like we are the underpinning that allows those projects to happen, and I think that that's great, because, you know, walking along the Cuyahoga River is going to be a totally different experience if it smells like sanny. If it doesn't smell like sanny, it's a great experience. So you know, we're a big part of that.
Speaker 2:And sanny is.
Speaker 3:Sanitary sewage.
Speaker 2:Okay, Come on everybody.
Speaker 1:For Sanitary sewage. Okay, come on, everybody For the noobs. Sandy, up For the noobs. Do you do any like end of year, new Year's resolutions? No, no.
Speaker 3:I think about that kind of stuff on more of a regular basis. I'm not a New.
Speaker 1:Year's resolution. Person Mike, what about you?
Speaker 2:New Year's resolutions.
Speaker 1:Yeah, are we going to the gym every day? What are we doing?
Speaker 2:I was thinking about this recently because I do toy with resolutions at the end of each year, but I think what I'm going to do most is being more aware of how my words or things I say might sound one way to me but come off differently to another person.
Speaker 3:That's so great.
Speaker 2:That's because that's my interpretation in my head of what I said. It's not how it's necessarily coming across. So I feel like I'm just trying to be more aware of that.
Speaker 3:And then also understanding that you might not understand the impact that you have on other people. That's a big thing to understand, for sure. And then I love thinking about the fact that, like, what you might see out of your eyes may actually not be the same view that people see out of their eyes, do you?
Speaker 2:know what I mean.
Speaker 3:Like people can interpret things differently and people can react to things differently, and just it's that whole idea of understanding that you're not going through the world alone and, like selfishness, is lonely and it's better to just not be lonely.
Speaker 2:Kyle Dreyfus-Wells, CEO of Northeast Ohio Regional Sewer District. Thanks for rejoining us.
Speaker 3:Thanks for having me On.
Speaker 2:Clean Water Works, and Happy New Year and Happy Holidays to you and your family.
Speaker 3:Same to you guys, thanks.
